What’s it like to work in the arts? To work for the arts. Not as a writer, musician, or sculptor, but rather as a mentor, organiser, a bringer together. Who is behind the art? Well, that’s exactly what I wanted to find out so I spoke to David Francis Moore, director of Dublin Fringe Fest and Valerie Bistany, director of the Irish Writers Centre.
“It’s like a reality TV show,” David says, “working on festivals. The thing about jobs in the arts is that even if you’re an administrator, you’re still around creative people which will always lead to an interesting experience.”
“…the city was my playground. You know, my night life, my good sandwich shop and it was very accessible. And for new families and new children growing up and working class families, that relationship to the city may not be the same because people can’t afford to live there anymore.”
Dublin Fringe Festival means a lot of things to a lot of different people. For some it’s pretentious, for some it’s confusing, for many it’s a time when the city feels a lot smaller and closer together. I asked David about his relationship with Dublin and this is what he told me; “It’s changed in that I actually no longer live in Dublin, I now commute to Dublin. There’s definitely been a shift in the available cultural spaces. I feel like with the development of the city, we’re losing a sense of, in some ways, history or an identity and heritage at times, I feel. It’s becoming a metropolis, which inevitably was going to go in that direction as to all capital cities, and then the city starts to expand. And then we see massive urbanisation. And so for me, what concerns me the most is that with that mass urbanisation and the rising costs of being in the city and what that’s doing to the demographics of people and the way we move to the city and the way we engage with the city. And that’s kind of scary because when I lived in Dublin, I was very close to the city. And so the city was my playground. You know, my night life, my good sandwich shop and it was very accessible. And for new families and new children growing up and working class families, that relationship to the city may not be the same because people can’t afford to live there anymore. And so that’s kind of sad, I think. And so, for Dublin fringe, I suppose it’s really important for us to create a space that enables people through ours to re-engage with the city and through culture.”
The burning question that’s always on my mind when I’m talking to any artistic person who is making money off of their creativity is always how did you manage that? So I was grateful to be able to ask David that very question. His answer was very insightful:
“I was also working in various other sectors to support myself because we all know that the arts don’t pay very well. And so I remember getting to a point where I was like, God, I feel like I’ve all these pockets of experiences, both within the arts I mean, and in other sectors and, you feel like an imposter in both because I think this is the challenge for a lot of artists all the time was that like, hey how do you believe you’re an artist if you’re working in a coffee shop for eight hours a day or, you know, so I remember when I was like, who am I? You know, it’s kind of an identity crisis, maybe a professional identity crisis and I went to see a career coach, actually, and a really amazing person. And she was like, this, it’s not a bad thing. When you have all these things. It’s like, what does all that mean? Together? And I was like, actually, yeah, I can take my understanding of art, I can take artistic practice, I can take business understanding, I can take marketing experience, and kind of package that into something that’s kind of useful.”
In terms of specifics, David studied drama and performance art at IADT, where he got an Erasmus Plus scholarship to study in Chicago for a year. He then went on to do an MFA in contemporary art, where he got another Erasmus scholarship to study collaborative art practices at the Manchester School of Art. However, when I asked him if university was the best place to go for creatives, he wasn’t too enthusiastic saying “ I think university or college gives you a great opportunity to develop your practice to develop your voice as who you are as an artist. But I do think when you finish if you don’t have that additional support or understanding of the sector in a more practical sense, it can be very, very, very, very overwhelming. And so I think higher education institutions have an obligation to find real world contexts for emerging artists to get a real sense of what that looks like, or leave colleges. If you’re a full time artist, you’re self employed. I mean, the basics of like, do your tax returns apply? For a funding application? What does that mean to be self employed insurance? I mean, they’re very fundamental basic things, but like you’re self employed. And so that needs to be supported as well.”
““Anyone who’s a freelance artist or freelance arts administrator is at the whims of what’s happening economically because obviously, when, if there are if the country is in the doldrums, one of the first places that government chooses to cut is usually the arts…”
Finally, I asked David what he considers to be his biggest mistake. He told me that it was not being kind enough to himself, explaining that “the art sector demands a lot, everyone because it’s under-resourced. It’s a sector where its currency is passion. So the people that are in the arts are really passionate about why they’re there. And so when you have a sector where the currency is passion, people go above and beyond in terms of ambition. And so there’s, there’s a cost to that, personally, professionally, and then other aspects of your life. And so, for me, I think that’s what I mean about not being kinder to myself. Yeah, that’s just taking time, like, you don’t have to achieve everything yesterday. So I’m getting better at that.”
The next person I was eager to talk to was Valerie Bistany. Because it is one thing to run a festival but something else entirely to revive a dying institution with your bare hands. And yet, that’s exactly what Valerie did. When she became the director of the Irish Writers Centre ten years ago, it was only a part-time position and the Centre hadn’t had a director in years. Now it employs many full time staff and holds competitions, workshops and retreats. It provides monetary support as well as educational facilities. When I tried to praise her though, she said humbly “I see myself as one of the caretakers of the institution”.
Valerie knows about the often tumultuous and unstable nature of working in the arts sector saying, “Anyone who’s a freelance artist or freelance arts administrator is at the whims of what’s happening economically because obviously, when, if there are if the country is in the doldrums, one of the first places that government chooses to cut is usually the arts because they don’t see it as being essential as other services.”
This is why, she believes, the Irish Writers Centre is so important. “It is home for writers, it’s as simple as that. It’s a home for writers in every sense of the word” she tells me, “this kind of goes against the idea of the writer, as writing as being a solitary activity. What we’re trying to do by creating this home for them, is to bring them together to say you’re not alone doing this. And there are people out there to help you.”
Valerie’s main philosophy is that writers work best when they work together, and building a sense of camaraderie and community is just as important as helping to get someone to finish their first draft.
Another issue on her mind is the climate. “Climate is massively significant now and urgent, and it’s hard not to lose hope or get overwhelmed. So it’s about how you navigate that territory. And how do you and the writers have the words to do that? And not only do they have the words, they also have the imagination to be able to think about what our world might look like, or what we could do to change our world. And I think writers have that mental facility, they are the philosophers, if you like, of our times. And they have that deep thinking critical faculty, which they can share with us. Not all of us are capable of expressing ourselves or know what we’re thinking and they just have the time and the space to do that”. Valerie created that time and space for writers by creating a ‘Writing the Earth’ program for writers which was sponsored by Pearse Street library and UNESCO. “It’s free, and it’s open to all in this online, and it happens six times a year. So it’s a free workshop anyway. The writers and the scientists were on stage. They were talking about their work and reading their work. And then we had actors who performed extracts of the plays. So there was a real buzz about it. It wasn’t like a normal reading at all. It was an event, you know, and then UNESCO afterwards, they put on a reception with organic wine and vegan food. So they deserve the thumbs up for that one. That was really great. So I got a big buzz out of that, I have to say like, it was one of the best events in my 10 years that I’ve been director.”
“If life imitates art then working in the arts imitates life…you don’t really know what’s going on or how you got there. But it seems there is hope after all for those of us who want to spend our days around eccentric creatives and writing arts grant proposals…it seems enthusiasm and passion will get you far in the game.”
Both David and Valerie are clear that despite their roles being administrative, they also have to use their creativity constantly at work. “I would say like 10 to 15% of my job is creative thinking and 85% is administration, which is not a high percentage, but I, you know, if you ask an artist that they will also probably have quite a high percentage, they will probably tell you, I spend a lot of time administering. So for instance, for a writer, it’s not enough that they have their book published, they then have to market it and promote it and go to festivals, some of them like it, some of them don’t. So because it’s about perception.”
Finally, I asked Valerie the same question I asked David, what’s her biggest mistake? She told me it was more of an ongoing battle with trying to balance her managerial skills and her creative personality. Frankly, she said “I do see myself as a creative person. And with that comes a certain kind of, um, let’s just say not very kind of attractive qualities like impatience. And, you know, I don’t suffer fools gladly, or, you know, that kind of thing that I can, I can be exacting, but it’s because I have no, no time to sounds really negative, but you know, I need everyone to work with me as a team and to be as committed as I am, I suppose. And when I see that someone isn’t, then I find that very difficult to deal with.”
So there you have it. It’s not easy working in the arts and there certainly doesn’t seem to be a specific degree or internship you have to get in order to work. If life imitates art then working in the arts imitates life…you don’t really know what’s going on or how you got there. But it seems there is hope after all for those of us who want to spend our days around eccentric creatives and writing arts grant proposals…it seems enthusiasm and passion will get you far in the game. And if David Frances Moore and Valerie Bistany can make mistakes, then so can you!
WORDS: Libby Marchant
